[00:00:04]
Y'ALL.[I. INVOCATION, PLEDGE & ROLL CALL]
OKAY.UH, AND WELCOME HERE TO THE CITY COUNCIL CHAMBERS HERE AT 4 44 FOURTH STREET AND CITY OF PORT ARTHUR FOR A CITY COUNCIL AND E D C JOINT MEETING.
UM, THAT SHOULD HAVE BEGUN AT ABOUT 4:00 PM AND IT'S NOW 4 0 7, AND WE ARE GATHERED HERE.
YOU MAY PARTICIPATE IN THE MEETING, BUT FIRST YOU MUST DIAL 8 7 7 8 5 3 5 2 4 7, OR 8 8 8 7 8 8 0 0 9 9, AND YOU WILL ENTER THE MEETING ID OF 8 1 6 9 6 9 9 1 3 6 3, AND PLACE THE PASSCODE OF 6 5 9 2 7 6 WHEN PROMPT, SO THAT YOU MAY PARTICIPATE IN THE MEETING.
ALSO, IN THIS MEETING, WE ARE IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE AMERICANS WITH DISABILITIES ACT, AND IF THERE WOULD BE A NEED FOR SPECIAL ACCOMMODATIONS, YOU WOULD FIRST CALL THE CITY SECRETARY'S OFFICE AT 4 0 9 9 8 3 8 1 1 5.
HOWEVER, IT MUST BE DONE 24 HOURS PRIOR TO THE MEETING, SO THE CITY SECRETARY AND HER STAFF WILL HAVE AMPLE TIME TO PROVIDE YOU WITH YOUR REQUEST.
WITH THAT BEING SAID, WE'D LIKE TO BEGIN THE MEETING IN OUR NORMAL FACTS AND WE'LL HAVE A PRAYER FASHION, BUT WE'LL HAVE A PRAYER, AND THEN WE WILL HAVE THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE OF COUNCILMAN KIMMEL.
WOULD YOU GIVE US A PRAYER, PLEASE? YES, MAYOR, WILL YOU STAND BY WITH ME OR HEAVEN? ANY FATHER, THANKS AGAIN FOR GIVING THIS OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE THIS SPECIAL MEETING.
CONTINUE PRAYING FOR THE CITY OF PORT ARTHUR.
WE ASK ALL THESE PRAYERS IN YOUR SON JESUS' NAME, I PRAY.
WE JOIN US NOW IN THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.
I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS, ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
CITY SECRETARY, WOULD YOU BE SO KIND AS TO ESTABLISH THE QUORUM FOR BOTH GROUPS, IF YOU WILL? YES.
MAYOR BARTEE PRESENT, MAYOR PROTE HAMILTON.
YOU HAVE A QUORUM OF THE CITY COUNCIL.
PRESENT DIRECTOR JERRY LEBO, PRESENT DIRECTOR RICHARD WYKOFF.
YOU HAVE A QUORUM IN BOTH SEATS, SIR.
AND AGAIN, WELCOME TO OUR JOINT MEETING.
WELCOME TO OUR JOINT MEETING OF THE PORT ARTHUR CITY COUNCIL AND THE E D C ON THIS, ON THIS AFTERNOON.
[II. TRAINING]
AND WE ACTUALLY HAVE THIS MEETING.WE'VE CALLED THIS MEETING, EXCUSE ME.
EXCUSE ME, FOR OUR TRAINING, AND IT'S A TRAINING REGARDING ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND MORE SUCCINCTLY, THE P A E D C BYLAWS AND TEXAS LAW REGARDING CITY COUNCIL OVERSIGHT RULES AND RESPONSIBILITIES.
WE HAVE A VERY ABLED ATTORNEY HERE WHO IS GOING TO HANDLE THE TRAINING FOR US AND WHAT I'D LIKE FOR US TO ESTABLISH NOW THAT WE WOULD ALLOW THE ATTORNEY TO CONDUCT THE TRAINING, IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, WOULD YOU PLEASE JUST JOT YOUR QUESTIONS DOWN? 'CAUSE WE DON'T WANNA STOP HIM AS HE GOES THROUGH HIS PRESENTATION.
SO IF YOU, YOU KNOW, HE'S MENTIONED SOMETHING THAT, THAT, THAT, THAT, UH, CAUSES SOMETHING TO ARISE AND YOUR THOUGHT PROCESSES, JUST, IF YOU WILL, JOT THOSE DOWN AND ONCE HE HAS COMPLETED HIS PRESENTATION, THEN YOU WILL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE THE QUESTIONS.
NOW, UH, EVEN WITH THE E D C BOARD OR INDIVIDUALS, WE WOULD, WE WOULD BE ABLE TO DO THAT THE SAME WAY NOW.
AND, AND I WANT US TO ALL TO BE TOGETHER.
I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY SEATS WE HAVE.
IS THAT OKAY? HE'S TALKING, HE'S TALKING RIGHT HERE.
AND EVERYBODY IS IN, IN, IN THE AUDIENCE.
[00:05:01]
IF YOU ALL DON'T MIND IF, IF YOU WILL BOARD MEMBERS, AND EVEN WITH YOUR, UH, THE, UH, DIRECTOR, BE YOUR C E O, YOU ALL COME AND SIT HERE.THAT WAY WE'RE TALKING, HE'S SPEAKING WITH ALL OF US.
AND, UH, THINK IT MIGHT BE A LITTLE TIGHT, BUT I THINK IT WOULD BE A LOT BETTER THAN YOU ARE TRYING TO LEARN SOMETHING THAN YOU AT THAT PERSON'S BACK.
OKAY? AND YOU MIGHT WANT JUST MUTE YOUR MIC.
I THINK IF IT'S SHOWING RED, WOULD YOU CHECK IT FOR MS. JACOBS C IF IT'S ON, JUST DO A TEST, MIC TEST ON IT.
IS THIS ON? IS IT IT? THAT WAS THE
SHE, SHE JUST GAVE IT UP, SO IT'S RED.
AND I APOLOGIZE, UH, FOR BEING A FEW MINUTES LATE.
I HIT SOME TRAFFIC I WAS NOT EXPECTING TO HIT.
UH, I SHOULD HAVE LEFT A LITTLE EARLIER AND I, I APOLOGIZE FOR HOLDING UP YOUR MEETING.
MY NAME IS CHARLIE ZACK, AND I WANT, THIS PROBABLY HAS A, UH, INTENT ON, AND I WANNA MAKE SURE EVERYBODY CAN HEAR ME, AND I'M NOT CUTTING IN AND OUT.
UM, MY NAME IS CHARLIE ZECK, AND IT'S FOR, FOR THE PURPOSES OF Y'ALL KNOWING WHO I AM AND, AND WHERE I COME FROM AND, UM, MY, MY EXPERTISE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, IN THIS AREA OF THE LAW.
BUT I MIGHT TELL Y'ALL JUST A LITTLE BIT ABOUT ME.
SO I AM WITH A LAW FIRM, DETON NAVARRO.
WE HAVE FOUR OFFICES ACROSS THE STATE OF TEXAS.
UH, WE HAVE OFFICES IN HARLINGEN.
WE HAVE OFFICES IN THE HOUSTON AREA.
WE HAVE OFFICES IN AUSTIN, AND WE HAVE OFFICES IN SAN ANTONIO.
WE HAVE, UH, ABOUT 23 LAWYERS THAT WORK FOR US.
ALL THAT WE DO IS PRACTICE IN THE AREA OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT LAW.
ALL WE DO IS REPRESENT, UM, CITIES AND COUNTIES AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS, MUNICIPAL DEVELOPMENT DISTRICTS, UNI, UM, UH, AND OTHER TYPES OF LOCAL GOVERNMENTS, TAX INCREMENT, REINVESTMENT ZONES, THINGS OF THAT NATURE.
AND WE'VE BEEN DOING THAT SINCE 1990.
PERSONALLY, I'VE BEEN DOING THAT SINCE 2001.
IN 2001, I WAS HIRED TO BE THE IN-HOUSE CITY ATTORNEY FOR THE CITY OF NEW BRAUNFELS, WHICH I DID FOR SIX YEARS.
IT WAS AT THAT POINT WHERE I REPRESENTED MY FIRST ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.
SO I'VE BEEN REPRESENTING ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS FOR ABOUT 22 YEARS NOW.
UM, WE CURRENTLY REPRESENT PROBABLY ABOUT 12 ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS THROUGHOUT THE STATE.
SOME OF THOSE WE REPRESENT, UM, BUT WE'RE NOT THE CITY ATTORNEY.
AND IN OTHERS WE REPRESENT, AND WE'RE ALSO THE CITY ATTORNEY.
AND THERE ARE SOME CITIES WHERE WE REPRESENT THE CITY, BUT WE DON'T REPRESENT THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.
SO IT JUST VARIES ACROSS THE STATE.
I SPEAK ON A REGULAR BASIS EVERY YEAR AT THE TEXAS MUNICIPAL LEAGUE'S ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CONFERENCE.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, THEY JUST REACHED OUT TO ME, AND I'LL BE SPEAKING AT THIS YEAR'S CONFERENCE, THIS PRESENTATION THAT I'M ABOUT TO GIVE YOU.
AND I'LL PROBABLY, UM, CHANGE IT UP A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE THIS PRESENTATION IS THE EXACT PRESENTATION I'VE BEEN GIVEN FOR THE LAST SIX OR SEVEN YEARS AT THE T M L ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CONFERENCE.
THE PURPOSE OF THIS PRESENTATION IS JUST TO GIVE A HIGH OVERVIEW OVER THE LAW WITH RESPECT TO TYPES OF PROJECTS AND EXPENDITURES THAT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS CAN UTILIZE.
ITS FOCUS REALLY IS ABOUT HOW ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS AND CITIES SHOULD OPERATE TOGETHER, AND THE STRUCTURE OF HOW THOSE WORK AND THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE TWO ORGANIZATIONS.
SO I WANT TO STRESS THAT I DID NOT PUT THIS PRESENTATION TOGETHER SPECIFICALLY FOR Y'ALL,
THIS IS A PRESENTATION THAT I GIVE ON A REGULAR BASIS, AND I WILL ACTUALLY BE GIVING IN NOVEMBER, AGAIN FOR ABOUT THE SEVENTH TIME, UH, FOR, FOR T M L.
SO, UM, AND, AND I GUESS OTHER THAN THAT, I HAVE A WIFE, A DAUGHTER, AND THREE DOGS THAT MY WIFE FORCED ON ME AFTER MY DAUGHTER WENT TO COLLEGE.
SO, UH, OTHER THAN THAT, UM, I THINK WE CAN START, UNLESS YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR ME ABOUT WITH RESPECT TO MY EXPERIENCE? NO.
SO, SO WHAT IS THE ROLE OF AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION? THE, THE ROLE OF AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, IT IS FIRST OF ALL AN INSTRUMENTALITY OF THE CITY.
AND THE ROLE IS TO UTILIZE THE SALES TAX DOLLARS GENERATED IN A WAY, CONSISTENT WITH THE ACT TO ASSIST THE CITY IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IN WHATEVER WAY THE CITY AND THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION COME TOGETHER AND AGREE AS THE APPROPRIATE WAY TO UTILIZE THOSE TAX DOLLARS.
AND IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT THOSE ARE TAX DOLLARS, THEY ARE SALES TAX DOLLARS, THE PUBLIC FUNDS.
[00:10:02]
WHERE DO WE FIND THE AUTHORITY FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS? WE FIND IT IN SUB CHAPTER C OF SUB CHAPTER C ONE OF, UM, I CAN'T REMEMBER THE TITLE, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY IN CHAPTER 5 0 1, CHAPTER 5 0 2, CHAPTER 5 0 4 AND CHAPTER 5 0 5 FOR PURPOSES OF THIS CONVERSATION, BECAUSE IT'S VERY SPECIFIC TO PORT ARTHUR, TEXAS, WHICH HAS A TYPE A ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, CORPORATIONS WILL BE FOCUSED ON 5 0 1, 5 0 2 AND 5 0 4 BECAUSE 5 0 5 IS ONLY APPLICABLE TO A TYPE B ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.THE OTHER AREA WHERE WE FIND OUR AUTHORITY AND FOLKS TEND TO FORGET ABOUT IT OR THEY DON'T EVEN KNOW, IS THE TEXAS NON-PROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT.
SECTION 5 0 1 0.504 SAYS SPECIFICALLY THAT A CORPORATION HAS THE POWERS PRIVILEGES, FUNCTIONS OF A NON-PROFIT CORPORATION INCORPORATED INTO THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT.
UM, AS, AS, UM, FORMED UNDER THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPOR CORPORATIONS LAW AS DESCRIBED BY SECTION 1 0 0 8 OF THE BUSINESS ORGANIZATIONS CODE.
THAT IS THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT.
TO THE EXTENT THAT THE PROVISIONS, UH, THE GOVERNING POWERS, PRIVILEGES, AND FUNCTIONS OF A NONPROFIT CORPORATION UNDER THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT IS IN CONFLICT WITH THE STATUTES THAT I JUST LISTED FOR YOU, THEN THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE WILL PREVAIL OVER THOSE PROVISIONS.
BUT WHERE THERE'S A VACANCY, WHERE THERE'S A GAP, WE LOOK TO THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT FOR AUTHORITY.
AND MOST FOLKS DON'T, DON'T REALIZE THAT BECAUSE AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS A NONPROFIT CORPORATION FORMED UNDER THE TEXAS NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT REVENUE FOR TYPE A SALES TAX.
AGAIN, UH, THE PURPOSE OF THIS PRESENTATION IS IT REALLY TO GET INTO THE DETAILS OF, OF THE TYPE OF AUTHORITY AND EXPENDITURES THAT CAN BE UTILIZED? THAT'S A DIFFERENT, UM, PRESENTATION.
I'M HAPPY TO GO OVER IT IN MORE DETAIL IF YOU'D LIKE TO.
BUT AS A GENERAL MATTER, UH, TYPE A TA SALES TAX IS PRIMARILY INTENDED FOR MANUFACTURING AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT, PRIMARY JOB CREATION, AND MAY BE USED TO ACQUIRE A PAY FOR LAND BUILDING EQUIPMENT, FACILITIES, EXPENDITURES, TARGET INFRASTRUCTURE, AND IMPROVEMENTS FOR PURPOSES RELATED TO, UH, THAT ISN'T IN THERE, SORRY, RELATED TO VERY SPECIFIC LISTED PROJECTS UNDER THE ACT.
AND WE, YOU CAN GO INTO THE ACT AND YOU CAN READ A, A LISTING OF WHAT YOU CAN DO THAT FOR.
BUT FOR PURPOSES OF THIS DISCUSSION, IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER THAT IT IS THAT TYPE A DOLLARS ARE ESSENTIALLY LIMITED, UM, TO, UH, MANUFACTURING AND INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AND PRIMARY JOB CREATION.
AND THAT'S OPPOSED TO A TYPE B SALES TAX, WHICH PROVIDES FOR A MUCH WIDER RANGE OF AUTHORITY TO SPEND THOSE SALES TAX DOLLARS.
AND I'M NOT GONNA GO INTO THOSE EITHER BECAUSE Y'ALL ARE NOT A TYPE B CORPORATION, AND SO IT ISN'T RELEVANT TO YOUR EXPENDITURES.
SO I ALWAYS ASK THIS QUESTION WHENEVER I'M GIVEN THIS PRESENTATION, YES OR NO, THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS A DISTINCT AND SEPARATE CORPORATION FROM THE CITY.
RAISE YOUR HAND IF YOU THINK THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION IS A YES.
IS IT DISTINCTIVE, DISTINCT, AND SEPARATE CORPORATION FROM THE CITY? WE HAVE A COUPLE FOLKS THAT BELIEVE IT'S A SEPARATE AND DISTINCT AND EVERYONE ELSE WHO THINKS IT IS NOT SEPARATE AND DISTINCT CORPORATION FROM THE CITY.
AND WE'VE GOT A LOT OF PEOPLE NOT PARTICIPATING, REFUSING TO RAISE THEIR HANDS, AND THAT'S OKAY.
DOES THAT MEAN WE'RE ON THE FENCE? DOES IT MEANS WE DON'T KNOW? THAT'S OKAY.
YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PARTICIPATE
SO LET'S, LET'S, SO I JUST GOT Y'ALL'S ANSWERS NOW LET'S TALK ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT AND THEN WE'LL ASK THE QUESTION AGAIN.
SO, THE TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE IS WHERE WE LOOK TO DETERMINE WHAT IS THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION AND A CITY, AND HOW THE STRUCTURE OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS CREATED IN ADDITION TO THE NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS ACT.
SO FIRST, SECTION 5 0 5 0.051 AUTHORIZES THE CREATION OF THE CORPORATION.
5 0 1 0.065 APPROVES THE, THE, SO LEMME BACK UP.
THE CITY DOES THESE THINGS PURSUANT TO THESE PROVISIONS
[00:15:01]
IN THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT.CODE AUTHORIZES THE CREATION OF THE CORPORATION.
THE CITY APPROVES THE CERTIFICATE OF FOR THE CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION THAT IS FILED AT THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE.
THE CITY APPOINTS THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS, THE CITY COUNCIL.
THE GOVERNING BODY IS ACTUALLY WHAT IT SAYS.
THE GOVERNING BODY APPOINTS THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
THE CITY COUNCIL APPROVES THE BYLAWS.
THE CITY COUNCIL APPROVES ALL PROGRAMS AND EXPENDITURES OF THE CORPORATION AND ANNUALLY REVIEWS ANY FINANCIAL STATEMENTS AND IS ENTITLED TO ACCESS TO ALL THE CORPORATE BOOKS AND RECORDS.
AND SECTION 5 0 1 0 0 7 OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE IS VERY SPECIFIC ABOUT THIS RELATIONSHIP.
A MUNICIPALITY MAY NOT LEND ITS CREDIT OR GRANT PUBLIC MONEY OR ANOTHER THING OF VALUE IN AID OF THE CORPORATION, EXCEPT UNDER A CONTRACT AUTHORIZED BY TEXAS LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE SECTION 3 80 0 0 2.
IN OTHER WORDS, THERE CAN BE NO GIFT OF FUNDS.
THERE CAN NO BE GIFT OF REVENUE, THERE CAN BE NO GIFT OF SERVICES TO FROM THE CITY TO THE CORPORATION, EXCEPT UNDER CHAPTER THREE 80, THE LOCAL GOVERNMENT CODE.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THE BOARD'S MAKEUP.
WE'LL JUST TALK ABOUT A TYPE A, THE CITY'S GOVERNING BODY APPOINTS AT LEAST A FIVE MEMBER BOARD FOR A TERM NOT TO EXCEED SIX YEARS.
WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? IT MEANS THAT THE CITY COUNCIL AS A GROUP SHALL APPOINT THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
THAT BOARD SHALL BE CONSIST OF NOT LESS THAN FIVE MEMBERS.
AND THE TERMS OF THOSE MEMBERS CANNOT EXCEED SIX YEARS.
AND SO IF WE LOOK AT THE ORIGINAL CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION THAT WAS FILED FOR, UH, THE PORT ARTHUR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION BACK IN 1996 OR 99 OR WHATEVER YEAR THAT WAS, I CAN'T REMEMBER EXACTLY, IT SAID THAT THE BOARD WOULD BE MADE UP OF FIVE MEMBERS IN 19, NO, IN 2018, I THINK IT WAS 20.
SOMEONE, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT ANYWAY, THERE WAS AN AMENDMENT FILED TO THE CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION THAT, THAT SAYS THE BOARD SHALL BE MADE UP OF SEVEN MEMBERS.
AND SO THAT'S HOW WE HAVE OUR CURRENT BOARD MEMBERSHIP OF SEVEN MEMBERS.
THERE WAS AN AMENDMENT TO THE, THE CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION STATE INCREASING THE NUMBER OF BOARD MEMBERS FROM FIVE TO SEVEN.
SO NOW I'VE GONE THROUGH THAT SPECIFIC LIST OF POWERS AND AUTHORITIES OF THE CITY OVER OVER A CORPORATION.
AND SO I ASK THE QUESTION AGAIN.
IS AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION A DISTINCT AND SEPARATE CORPORATION FROM THE CITY? HOW MANY PEOPLE BELIEVE THAT IT IS GOT ONE THERE ANOTHER THERE? SAME.
SO, YOU KNOW, IT'S KIND OF A TRICK QUESTION,
IT IS SET UP AS A SEPARATE NON-PROFIT CORPORATION.
HOWEVER, THE CITY COUNCIL APPOINTS THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS, THOSE BOARD OF DIRECTORS CAN BE REMOVED FOR ANY REASON, UM, FOR CAUSE OR NOT FOR CAUSE.
UM, FROM THE BOARD, AT ANY TIME THE CITY COUNCIL APPROVES THE CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION MAY AMEND THAT CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION.
IT APPROVES THE BYLAWS, IT, AND IT APPROVES ALL THE EXPENDITURES, ALL THE PROGRAMS AND, UM, OF, OF THE CORPORATION AND HAS THE RIGHT TO ACCESS ALL OF THE RECORDS AND BOOKS OF THE CORPORATION.
AND SO IT IS TECHNICALLY A SEPARATE CORPORATION DISTINCT FROM THE CITY.
BUT IN PRACTICE, IF THE CORPORATION DOES NOT, UM, IN, IN PRACTICE, THE CITY COUNCIL HAS THE RIGHT TO CHOOSE HOW IT SPENDS ITS MONEY AND WHO SITS ON THE BOARD.
AND SO IN PRACTICE, UM, IT IS CLEARLY AN INSTRUMENTALITY OF THE CITY AND THERE SHOULD BE A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE BOARD AND THE COUNCIL MEMBERS MAKING SURE WE'RE ALL MOVING TOGETHER IN THE SAME DIRECTION.
SO HERE'S A IS WHO BELIEVES THIS IS A STATEMENT OF FACT.
AND REMEMBER, THIS IS A PRESENTATION THAT I GIVE TO, UM, UH, UM, A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE AT THE SAME TIME FROM ACROSS THE STATE OF TEXAS.
AND SO THIS IS ALWAYS AN INTERESTING QUESTION.
UM, RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN BOARDS AND CITY COUNCILS ARE BECOMING MORE
[00:20:01]
FRACTURED THAN USUAL.YEAH, I I'M GONNA RAISE MY HAND AND SAY YES TO THAT.
THAT'S NOT SPECIFICALLY WITH RESPECT TO PORT ARTHUR.
THAT IS JUST A GENERAL, MY GENERAL IMPRESSION ACROSS THE STATE OF TEXAS IN ALL THE CITIES AND EDCS AND OTHER LOCAL GOVERNMENTS THAT, THAT, THAT I REPRESENT, THERE IS BECOMING THIS FRACTURED RELATIONSHIP.
AND THAT IS ESPECIALLY TRUE IN THE RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS AND CITIES.
AND THE REASON FOR THAT, IN MY OPINION, IS SHRINKING DOLLARS.
THE AMOUNT OF DOLLARS THAT CITIES ARE AUTHORIZED TO, UM, RAISE, UH, THROUGH THE AUTHORITY OF THE TEXAS LEGISLATURE IS SHRINKING.
THE TEXAS LEGISLATURE CONTINUES TO PUT UNFUNDED MANDATES ON CITIES IN THE FACE OF THOSE SHRINKING DOLLARS, WHICH RESULTS IN SHRINKING REVENUES TO CITIES, WHICH IS RESULTS IN A CITY GOING ON THE HUNT FOR ADDITIONAL REVENUES WHEREVER THEY CAN FIND THEM IN ORDER TO PROVIDE THE SERVICES TO THEIR COMMUNITY.
THOSE, THOSE ARE JUST, THOSE ARE, I MY, THOSE ARE STATEMENTS OF FACT.
THAT'S JUST THE REALITIES IN WHICH WE ARE CURRENTLY OPERATING AS LOCAL GOVERNMENTS.
AND IN MY OPINION, THAT'S THE REASON WHY WE'RE STARTING TO HAVE THIS, THIS CONFLICT.
AND AGAIN, I REPRESENT A LOT OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS AND A LOT OF CITIES, AND I'M SEEING THAT ACROSS THE STATE.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THAT RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION AND THE CITY.
THE E D C, DESPITE THE E D C, I MEAN, THE CITY, UM, SHOULD NOT UTILIZE THE E D C DESPITE THE CITY'S AUTHORITY TO APPROVE THE EXPENDITURES, TO APPROVE THE PROGRAMS, AND TO DICTATE THOSE THINGS.
SHOULD NOT USE THE E D C AS A TOOL.
THE E D C SHOULD BE A PARTNER WITH THE CITY IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
IN MY HUMBLE OPINION, IN MY 20 SOME YEARS OF DOING THIS, THE REASON WHY WE HAVE A SEPARATE BOARD APPOINTED TO THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS TO MAKE SURE WE BRING FRESH PERSPECTIVE TO THE THOUGHT PROCESS OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
AND A AND A WELL-FUNCTIONING CITY AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION SITUATION SHOULD RESULT IN A PARTNERSHIP.
IT'S NOT REALLY A CHECK OR A BALANCE.
AND IT'S NOT REALLY ABOUT VETTING CITY COUNCIL'S DECISION MAKING.
IT IS ABOUT WORKING TOGETHER TO ACCOMPLISH DESIRED OUTCOMES IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
AND REMEMBER, THAT MEANS DIFFERENT THINGS TO DIFFERENT COMMUNITIES.
IN SOME COMMUNITIES THAT MEANS PRIMARY JOB CREATION.
WE WANT TO FOCUS ON CREATING PRIMARY JOBS IN OTHER, IN OTHER COMMUNITIES.
THAT MEANS A FOCUS IS ON CAPITAL INVESTMENT IN THE CITY TO CREATE, UM, UM, COMMERCIAL VALOREM TAX DOLLARS TO ASSIST IN KEEPING OTHER TAX DOLLARS LOWER, UM, OTHER TAX, OTHER, UH, AD ALARM, PROPERTY TAXES LOWER, IT JUST DEPENDS ON THE COMMUNITY AND WHAT THE FOCUS SHOULD BE.
BUT THOSE FOCUSES AND DESIRED OUTCOMES SHOULD BE ALIGNED BETWEEN THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION AND THE CITY COUNCIL.
HOW DO YOU DO THAT? FIRST, THERE SHOULD BE SET CLEAR OBJECTIVES BY THE CITY COUNCIL FOR THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, VERY CLEAR.
SO THAT THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION KNOWS WHAT TYPES OF PROJECTS AND EXPENDITURES IT SHOULD BE BRINGING FORWARD OR AGREED UPON BETWEEN THE TWO ENTITIES.
IT SHOULD RESULT, WE SHOULD, UH, BE ATTEMPTING TO PROVIDE ALIGNMENT BETWEEN THE OPINIONS OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION AND THE CITY.
WE SHOULD ESTABLISH SOLID RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN BOTH BOARDS AND WE SHOULD ALSO BE LOOKING FOR APPROPRIATE USE OF TAX DOLLARS.
THAT'S BOTH IN THE LEGAL SENSE AND IN THE POLICY SENSE.
SO WE WANNA BE, AND I DON'T USE BIG WORDS VERY OFTEN BECAUSE I CAN VERY RARELY PRONOUNCE THEM.
THAT MEANS WE SHOULD BE SYMBIOTIC.
WE SHOULD HAVE A MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN BOTH BOARDS, BOTH ENTITIES.
[00:25:01]
WE GET THERE THROUGH TEAMWORK.WE NEED TO COMMUNICATE AND COLLABORATE BOTH AT THE BOARD LEVEL AND AT THE STAFF LEVEL.
THAT MEANS, IN MY OPINION, CITY COUNCILS AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS SHOULD BE MEETING AT A MINIMUM TWICE A YEAR AND IN THE BEST SITUATION FOUR TIMES A YEAR IN A WORKSHOP, IN, IN A ROOM WHERE THEY ARE COMMUNICATING ABOUT THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES FOR THE CITY.
AND THEN AFTER THEY ESTABLISH THOSE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES, CHECKING IN TO MAKE SURE WE'RE ACCOMPLISHING THOSE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES, THAT WE'RE STILL MOVING DOWN THE SAME PATH TOGETHER.
AND THAT THOSE GOALS AND OB OBJECTIVES DON'T NEED TO BE ADJUSTED AS A RESULT OF SOME CHANGE, UH, THAT HAS OCCURRED BETWEEN THE, BETWEEN PREVIOUS MEETINGS.
THAT'S FOR THE, THAT'S FOR THE, THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE BOARD STAFF SHOULD BE REGULARLY COMMUNICATING TO ENSURE THAT THE OBJECTIVES OF THE TWO BOARDS ARE BEING MOVED FORWARD ON, ON THE, ON THE FEET, ON THE GROUND LEVEL, ON A REGULAR BASIS TO HAVE A SOLID COMMUNICATION.
SO BOTH AT THE BOARD LEVEL AND AT THE STAFF LEVEL, THAT COMMUNICATION SHOULD BE A TWO-WAY STREET.
THE BOTH BOARDS SHOULD LISTEN TO EACH OTHER, HEAR EACH OTHER, UNDERSTAND EACH OTHER, AND BE ABLE TO COMPROMISE ON ISSUES.
WE SHOULD ENSURE THAT WE HAVE APPROPRIATE FEEDBACK.
WE SHOULD UNDERSTAND WHO DOES WHAT, WHICH IS UNDERSTANDING THE RESPONSIBILITIES OF EACH BODY AND THE INDIVIDUALS ASSOCIATED WITH THEM.
AND THEN I ALWAYS SAY THIS TO THE CITY COUNCILS, DON'T MICROMANAGE.
YOU HAVE APPOINTED, AND I'M NOT, AGAIN, THIS SOUNDS LIKE I'M TALKING TO Y'ALL SPECIFICALLY, BUT THIS IS MY GENERAL, THESE ARE MY GENERAL STATEMENTS, RIGHT, THAT I GIVE ON A REGULAR BASIS.
CITY COUNCILS SHOULD NOT BE MICROMANAGING THE DAY-TO-DAY ACTIVITIES OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.
OTHERWISE YOU SHOULD JUST BE THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, WHICH BY THE LAW, THE YOU CANNOT DO
YOU HAVE TO HAVE A SEPARATE BOARD FOR THAT.
AND SO, UM, SET THE CLEAR OBJECTIVES, HAVE THE REGULAR MEETINGS, AND LET STAFF AND THE BOARD PERFORM THEIR RESPONSIBILITIES THAT THEY'VE BEEN TASKED TO DO.
YOU HAVE APPOINTED AS A BODY INTELLIGENT, SMART PEOPLE WHO KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING AND AFTER THEY'VE BEEN PROVIDED THE OBJECTIVES AND THE GOALS, LET THEM GO ABOUT DOING THAT.
SO WHAT IS THE EDCS ROLE ALIGNMENT, RIGHT? FIRST CITY COUNCIL GOALS.
THESE ARE CITY COUNCIL GOALS, DEVELOPMENT ISSUES, REGULATORY ISSUES, AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
RIGHT? THERE'S A LOT ON THEIR PLATE.
BUT THAT'S A, THAT'S A BROAD UMBRELLA.
THE LAW, THE LAW DICTATES WHAT WE CAN AND WHAT WE CAN'T DO.
RIGHT? AND THEN FINALLY, THE EDCS GOALS ARE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PURELY AND SIMPLY THEY'RE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT GOALS.
AND WHAT WE WANT, WHAT THE GOAL OF THE E D C SHOULD BE IS ALIGNMENT OF ALL THESE THINGS AND WHERE THE LAW AND THE E D C GOALS ASSOCIATED WITH ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND THE CITY COUNCIL'S GOALS ASSOCIATED WITH DEVELOPMENT, REGULATORY AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, AND THAT VENN DIAGRAM AND THAT LITTLE CENTER, THAT'S WHERE WE WANNA BE.
THAT'S WHERE WE WANT TO BE ABLE TO MEET, TO MOVE FORWARD.
AND THAT WAS VERY QUICKLY, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT USUALLY TAKES ME ABOUT AN HOUR TO DO
UH, BUT USUALLY I GET QUESTIONS IN THE MIDDLE OF IT.
SO THE, I GUESS THE OVERALL THEME OF THIS PRESENTATION IS TO REMIND FOLKS THAT, THAT THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS A, IS A DISTINCT CORPORATION IN PRACTICE AND IN, IN THE LAW IS SET UP AS A NONPROFIT CORPORATION.
BUT I REMIND MY A D C BOARD MEMBERS THAT THEY, UM, THEY, THEY ARE SUBJECT TO THE AUTHORITY OF THE CITY COUNCIL, BOTH IN THEIR, IN THE BOARD MEMBER APPOINTMENT, BOTH AND IN, UM, APPROVAL OF HOW THEY SPEND THEIR DOLLARS AND WHAT PROGRAMS ARE CREATED, WHERE THOSE DOLLARS ARE SPENT, AND, UM, AND, AND MAKING SURE THAT THE MONIES ARE SPENT IN THAT WAY THROUGH, OVER IN THE APPROPRIATE WAY THROUGH, THROUGH, THROUGH OVERSIGHT.
BUT IT IS A SEPARATE ENTITY WITH A VERY SPECIFIC PURPOSE, WITH VERY SPECIFIC SALES TAX DOLLARS.
AND THEY SHOULD BE GIVE THOSE THAT BOARD, ONCE THEY'VE BEEN GIVEN THOSE OBJECTIVES, BECAUSE YOU'VE APPOINTED COMPETENT FOLKS TO THE BOARD, THE CITY COUNCIL SHOULD
[00:30:01]
GIVE THAT BOARD THE FLEXIBILITY TO PROVIDE, TO THEN MOVE FORWARD BASED ON THOSE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES.AND NOW I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.
UH, CITY COUNCILMAN BECKHAM? THANK YOU, MAYOR.
UH, I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT 5 0 4 0.051 C AND THE INTERPRETATION OF THAT.
UM, THIS IS THE PROVISION THAT SAYS THAT, UM, GOVERNING BODY OF THE AUTHOR, UH, AUTHORIZING MUNICIPALITY SHALL DETERMINE THE NUMBER OF DIRECTORS IN THE LENGTH OF EACH DIRECTOR'S TERM.
EXCEPT THAT, AND THIS IS THE PART I WANT YOU TO CLARIFY FOR US, THE LENGTH OF A DIRECTOR'S TERM MAY NOT EXCEED SIX YEARS.
SO MY, MY QUESTION IS, CAN SOMEONE BE APPOINTED AS A DIRECTOR AND SERVE A TERM OF SIX YEARS AND COME OFF AND THEN BE REAPPOINTED BY SOMEONE ELSE? SOME OTHER COUNCIL MEMBER REAPPOINT THAT PERSON TO ANOTHER TERM? UM, SO I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA ANSWER THAT QUESTION THIS WAY.
THE PURPOSE OF THAT IS TO SAY EACH INDIVIDUAL TERM CAN BE NO LONGER THAN SIX YEARS.
SO RIGHT NOW THOUGH, YOUR CERTIFICATE OF FORMATION DICTATES THAT THE TERMS ARE THREE YEARS.
AND SO THE ANSWER, SO IT, TO GIVE AN EXAMPLE THAT I THINK ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION, IF AN INDIVIDUAL HAS BEEN APPOINTED TO, AND I DON'T KNOW, I THINK I KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY COUNCIL MEMBER, AND WE PROBABLY WANNA DISCUSS THAT A LITTLE BIT.
UM, BUT, AND BECAUSE IT'S THREE YEAR TERMS, AN INDIVIDUAL CAN BE APPOINTED TO A, TO ONE THREE YEAR TERM, THEY CAN THEN BE REAPPOINTED FOR ANOTHER THREE YEAR TERM, AND THEN THEY CAN BE REAPPOINTED FOR ANOTHER THREE YEAR TERM, AND THEN THEY CAN BE REAPPOINTED FOR ANOTHER THREE YEAR TERM.
UM, FOR AS MANY TIMES AS THE COUNSEL AND I, I EMPHASIZE THE COUNCIL DETERMINES THAT THEY SHOULD BE, THAT THEY WANT TO APPOINT THAT INDIVIDUAL.
WHAT YOU CAN'T DO IS CREATE A CER A SITUATION WHERE THE TERM IS SEVEN YEARS, SO THAT THEY SERVE SEVEN YEARS FOR ONE TERM.
UH, COUNCILMAN DOUCETTE? ALRIGHT, CHARLIE, LET'S TALK ABOUT THE, UH, APPOINTMENT.
5 0 4 SAYS THE DIRECTORS ARE APPOINTED BY THE A AUTHOR, UH, UH, THE GOVERN AUTHORIZING MUNICIPALITY.
I'M GONNA SAY THE COUNCIL, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT MEANS, RIGHT? BODY MEANS A COUNCIL.
SO IT SAYS THEY ARE APPOINTED BY THE COUNCIL.
SO IF THE COUNCIL CHOOSES TO ELECT THE OPTION INSTEAD OF THE BOARD OR THE COUNCIL, APPRO, I MEAN, APPOINTED THE COUNCIL SAYS EACH COUNCIL MEMBER WILL APPOINT A DIRECTOR ONCE THE DIRECTORS ARE APPOINTED.
IN ESSENCE, ISN'T THAT APPOINTED BY THIS BOARD? IT'S, I MEAN, THEY SAY APPOINT, IT DOESN'T SAY HOW TO APPOINT.
AND YOU'RE BEING APPOINTED BY YOU COUNCIL.
I MEAN, I, I I DON'T SEE WHERE THERE'S SHOULD BE ANY DIFFERENCE THERE.
UH, SO I, I I THINK YOUR QUESTION IS, SO IT IS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE CURRENT PRACTICE OF THIS GOVERNING BODY, RIGHT, IS TO HAVE A COUNCIL MEMBER APPOINT AN, A INDIVIDUAL TO THE BOARD.
THAT APPOINTMENT IS NOT CONFIRMED BY THIS BO BY THE CITY COUNCIL.
ONCE THE CITY COUNCIL MAKES THE APPOINTMENT, THAT PERSON IS THEN CONSIDERED TO BE APPOINTED TO THE E D C.
AM I WRONG ABOUT THE, IF I'M WRONG ABOUT IT, THAT'S, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE, BUT THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING.
WELL, WHAT, WHAT IT HAS BEEN, WHAT IT HAS BEEN AS A PRACTICE IS THAT WHOMEVER THE COUNCIL MEMBER ELECTED TO APPOINT, THAT'S WHO WOULD BE SWORN IN AND APPOINTED.
AND WHY ARE THEY SWORN IN? I'M GONNA MINUTE, I'M JUST GONNA ASK ALL SORTS OF QUESTIONS.
WAIT MINUTE,
I SAID, IF IT SAYS THAT WE APPOINT PEOPLE, WHY IS IT NECESSARY FOR APPROVAL? I WAS TOLD, WELL,
[00:35:01]
IT'S JUST SO THAT WE COULD, UH, PUT IT IN THE RECORDS APPROVING IT TO BE PLACED ON A RECORD.RIGHT? BECAUSE IT DID NOT MEET THE COMMON SENSE TEST TO ME EITHER.
IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING WRITTEN THAT SAYS, THIS IS HOW WE DO IT, BECAUSE THE BYLAWS WAS APPROVED BY A COUNCIL.
BUT THEY'RE NOT BINDING ON CITY COUNCIL.
BUT THE BYLAWS ARE NOT BINDING ON CITY COUNCIL.
NO, NO, I'M JUST SAYING THEY'RE NOT BINDING.
BUT WHAT I'M SAYING IS, WAS WRITTEN IN 'EM MM-HMM.
UH, I WOULD HOPE SO, BECAUSE THAT'S THE LAW.
SO ANYTHING THAT'S WRITTEN IS NOT LIKE COUNCIL DIDN'T APPROVE IT.
SO IF COUNCIL APPROVED THE METHOD IN WHICH WE GOING TO APPOINT, THEN I JUST, I JUST DIDN'T SEE SO IS THE, IS IS ALL RIGHT.
SO I'M GONNA BACK UP AND I'M GONNA GO BACK TO YOUR ORIGINAL QUESTION, WHICH, WHICH I BELIEVE IS, IS THE APPOINTMENT BY A COUNCIL MEMBER SUFFICIENT UNDER THE LAW? THAT'S, I THINK WHAT THE QUESTION IS.
AND THAT'S THE QUESTION WE HAVE, AND THAT'S THE KIND WE ASK AN OPINION.
BUT THE THING IS, IF YOU TAKE A LOOK AT IT, IT SAYS THOSE DIRECTORS ARE APPOINTED BY THE COUNCIL.
SO YES, IF EVERYBODY OVER THERE IS APPOINTED BY A COUNCIL MEMBER, AND THAT SAYS EVERYBODY OVER THERE IS APPOINTED BY THE COUNCIL.
WHY NOT? BECAUSE THE STATUTE SAYS THAT THE, THAT THE MEMBERS ARE APPOINTED BY THE GOVERNING BODY.
IT DOESN'T SAY IT'S A, THEY'RE APPOINTED BY INDIVIDUAL COUNCIL MEMBERS.
IT SAYS THAT THEY'RE APPOINTED BY THE GOVERNING BODY.
THEN WHY ARE WE APPOINTED AN INDIVIDUAL THEN? I HAVE NO IDEA.
WELL, I'M JUST SAYING I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER.
WE DON'T WANNA GET TOO TECHNICAL COUNCILMAN WITH IT.
LET'S, LET'S ASK THE ATTORNEY.
AND I THINK WE ARE ASKING FOR BASICALLY A, IT'S DIFFERENT INTERPRETATIONS ACCORDING TO INDIVIDUALS.
ALL OF US HAVE OUR IN, HOW ABOUT IF I GIVE YOU MY OPINION UNDERSTANDINGS OF IT.
RIGHT? AND, AND WE MAY NOT TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU, BUT WHEN, WHEN, WHEN HE SAID THIS.
SO LET'S, LET'S NOT BADGER HIM AND CONTINUE TO ASK THE SAME QUESTION OVER AND OVER.
OKAY? BECAUSE THEN AT THAT POINT, I'M ABOUT TO CALL THE POINT OF ORDER SO WE CAN CONTINUE TO MOVE THE MEETING.
YEAH, I CAN, I'M HAPPY TO GIVE YOU MY APPOINTMENT.
THIS IS, LEMME JUST GIVE YOU POINT OF ORDER.
ALLOW THE PROFESSIONAL TO ANSWER THE QUESTION.
SO THIS IS MY OPINION, THE STA SO I'M GONNA BACK UP AND JUST GIVE YOU A LITTLE OVERVIEW OF HOW STATUTES ARE INTERPRETED.
THE COURTS INTERPRET STATUTES BY THE PLAIN LANGUAGE OF THE STATUTE.
THAT'S HOW COURTS INTERPRET IT.
THIS STATUTE, BY ITS PLAIN LANGUAGE, SAYS THAT THE APPOINTMENTS TO THE BOARD SHALL BE MADE BY THE GOVERNING BODY, NOT BY INDIVIDUAL COUNCIL MEMBERS.
IT SAYS BY THE GOVERNING BODY, WHICH WOULD REQUIRE A VOTE OF THE ENTIRE GOVERNING BODY TO MAKE AN APPOINTMENT UNDER THE LAW.
NOW, I'LL, I'LL ANSWER THAT IN A MINUTE, BUT ME IN THE FUTURE, IF YOU RECOGNIZE ME AND, AND YOU WISH TO SAY SOMETHING, PLEASE DO A PART OF ORDER, NOT JUST OVERTALK ME.
AND THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO EVERYBODY.
JUST, UH, DO A PART OF ORDER AND I'LL STOP AND YOU COULD TELL ME, AND THEN I'LL DO THAT.
OKAY? UH, BUT CHARLIE, UH, THAT'S MY WHOLE POINT TOO, WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT IT, AND, UH, I'M NOT BADGERING YOU AND I KNOW, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT, BUT I JUST WANT TO GET CLARIFICATION BECAUSE I KNOW THIS IS WHAT YOU DO, AND WE NEED CLARIFICATION AND WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND IT BECAUSE AT THE END OF THE DAY, UH, I, I, I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
AND THAT'S THE WAY I LOOKED AT IT UNTIL WE GOT TO THE POINT WHEREBY THIS COUNCIL AND THE CORPORATION AT SOME TIME DECIDED THAT WE WANT TO DO IT THIS WAY.
BECAUSE WHAT IS WRITTEN MEANS THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE DOING IT INDIVIDUALLY.
WE SHOULD BE DOING IT COLLECTIVELY.
IF WHAT I UNDERSTAND YOU TO SAY CORRECTLY, 'CAUSE, SO BASICALLY BY US DOING IT INDIVIDUALLY, IT'S NOT RIGHT.
AND I'M LIKE THIS, I'M ALL FOR BLACK AND WHITE.
SO IF WE CAN'T DO IT INDIVIDUALLY, I'M FOR IT.
IF WE GOTTA DO IT COLLECTIVELY, LET'S DO IT COLLECTIVELY.
[00:40:01]
IT INDIVIDUALLY AND SAY WE GOTTA DO IT COLLECTIVELY.IF WE NEED TO DO IT COLLECTIVELY, THEN WE NEED TO ELIMINATE THE INDIVIDUAL.
AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS SAYING, BECAUSE IT'S CONFUSING.
UH, AND THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION.
ONE OF THE, JUST AS A SIDEBAR, OR NOT A SIDEBAR, BUT I LIKE THE, THE PRESENTATION AND I LIKE THE LITTLE CIRCLE IN THE MIDDLE WHERE WE ALL CAN BRING ALL WHAT WE HAVE TOGETHER AND LET'S GET A GOOD UNDERSTANDING AND COME TOGETHER AND GET IT RIGHT.
'CAUSE I THINK THIS IS A GOOD EDUCATIONAL TOOL.
'CAUSE OFTEN, YOU KNOW, YOU READ SOMETHING IN THE STATUTE AND YOU, YOU BLEND IT WITH SOMETHING ELSE, AND THEN IT ALL GETS ALL CONFUSED.
SO I THINK THIS IS A GREAT TOOL, AND I THINK THAT WE CAN GET THERE.
YOU KNOW, I DEFINITELY THINK WE CAN GET THERE.
UM, AND THIS IS A GOOD WAY TO GET THERE.
I JUST WANTED TO GIVE A LITTLE HISTORY ABOUT WHERE THE CONFUSION MAY HAVE STARTED AND WHAT THE INTENT WAS, AND KIND OF HOW WE GOT TO MAYBE WHERE WE ARE.
AND THEN Y'ALL CAN DECIDE WHERE YOU WANT TO GO.
SO IT WAS ALWAYS, UM, FOR SOME YEARS WHERE THE COUNCIL, YOU KNOW, DID IT BY RESOLUTION.
BUT WHEN THE E D C BACK IN 2018, THEY COMBED THROUGH THE BYLAWS AND THEY MADE THIS SUGGESTION, AND I THINK THEY WANTED IT TO BE, AND I SAID THIS IN ANOTHER MEETING, LIKE, SOME OF THESE OTHER BOARDS GIVE EVERY COUNCIL MEMBER A VOICE TO APPOINT SOMEONE.
SO THAT'S WHY THEY PUT IT IN THERE.
UM, AND YOU KNOW, EVEN RIGHT HERE IT SAYS SELECTION PROCESS.
YOU KNOW, MAYBE THE WORD APPOINTED MAY NOT HAVE BEEN THE BEST WORD TO USE, BUT THE INTENT WAS JUST LIKE, SO WE WON'T HAVE A MEETING AND SAY, OKAY, WHO DO Y'ALL WANT? AND EVERYBODY'S TRYING TO THINK OF A NAME.
IT WAS TRYING TO GET EVERY COUNCIL MEMBER REPRESENTED.
AND, UM, SO THAT, THAT CHANGE TOOK PLACE IN 2018.
BUT I THINK THIS, THIS SITUATION THAT WE'VE BEEN IN DOES GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT THE LEMONADE INSTEAD OF THE LEMONS.
GIVES US AN OPPORTUNITY TO LOOK AT STATE LAW, LOOK AT WHAT OUR INTENT IS AND TRY TO GET THERE, YOU KNOW, IN THE RIGHT WAY.
BUT, AND LIKE I SAID, THERE WAS A SITUATION THAT CAME UP AND THEN NOW ULTIMATELY WE HAVE TO LOOK AT WHAT, WHAT THE ULTIMATE AUTHORITY IS, IS STATE LAW.
SO I THINK THIS GIVES US A, A WAY OF GETTING THOSE QUESTIONS ANSWERED AND THEN COMING UP WITH A WAY OF GETTING IT DONE, RIGHT.
BECAUSE, UM, WE HAVE A LOT OF THINGS THAT WE HONOR HERE IN THE CITY, BUT WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO IT, YOU GOTTA LOOK AT WHAT STATE LAW SAYS, AND SOMETIMES THAT CAN BE CONFUSING.
SO I THANK YOU FOR THE PRESENTATION.
YES, SIR, FOR YOUR PRESENTATION.
UH, I GOT A QUESTION ABOUT THE MAKEUP OF CITIES.
UH, AND I HEARD YOU BRIEFLY TALK ABOUT, UH, TYPE A VERSUS TYPE B CORPORATIONS.
CORPORATIONS, UH, YOU KNOW, AND I UNDERSTAND IT, IT, IT DEPENDS ON THE CITY AND WHAT IT, AND WHAT IT WANT TO ACHIEVE.
YOU KNOW, LIKE BUSINESS, UH, INDUSTRIAL THEATER, DOWNTOWN DEVELOPMENT, A CITY LIKE PORT ARTHUR THAT IS GROWING, THAT'S TURNING THE CURB, THAT'S TURNING THE SHIP AROUND.
WHAT WOULD YOU RECOMMEND, IN YOUR OPINION, BASED UPON THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES YOU'VE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER? WHAT TYPE OF FORMAT SHOULD WE USE? JUST, AND I KNOW YOU SAID EARLIER WE'RE TYPE A WHEN WE ARE, WE HAVE BEEN FOR A WHILE.
SO HOW DO YOU DETERMINE WHAT IS BEST INTEREST FOR CITIES BASED UPON WHAT THEY HAVE IN THEIR COMMUNITIES? I I'M A FIRM BELIEVER IN FLEXIBILITY.
I'M A FIRM BELIEVER IN MAKING SURE YOU HAVE ALL THE TOOLS IN YOUR TOOLBOX TO ACCOMPLISH WHAT YOU MAY WANT TO ACCOMPLISH AT ANY GIVEN TIME.
A TYPE A CORPORATION IS VERY LIMITED IN HOW IT CAN SPEND THOSE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DOLLARS.
A TYPE B CORPORATION GIVES YOU GREATER FLEXIBILITY IN HOW YOU CAN SPEND THOSE DOLLARS.
A MUNICIPAL DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT, HAS ANYBODY HEARD OF THAT? MUNICIPAL DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT MM-HMM.
AND IT AUTHORIZES YOU TO COLLECT A SALES TAX IN YOUR EXTRATERRITORIAL JURISDICTION.
SO TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU HAVE COMMERCIAL RETAIL ENTITIES IN YOUR E T J THAT COLLECTS SALES TAX, AND TO THE EXTENT THAT A PART OF THAT SALES TAX IS AVAILABLE STILL TO CAPTURE, IT ALLOWS A CITY TO CAPTURE THAT SALES TAX.
SO WHEN A CITY FIRST COMES TO ME AND THEY HAVE AVAILABLE SALES TAX IN THEIR COMMUNITY AND IN THEIR E T J AND THEY DON'T HAVE AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION, MY FIRST STATEMENT TO THEM IS, CREATE A MUNICIPAL DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT, BECAUSE THAT'S YOUR GREATEST FLEXIBILITY AND ALLOWS YOU TO CAPTURE THE GREATEST AMOUNT OF SALES TAX.
IT IS OFTENTIMES, UM, DIFFICULT TO TRY TO CONVERT FROM A TYPE A OR A TYPE B ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION TO A MUNICIPAL DEVELOPMENT DISTRICT.
[00:45:01]
THE LOGISTICS OF VOTING.AND I'M NOT GONNA GET INTO THE DETAILS OF THAT, BUT SOMETIMES IT'S PROBLEMATIC TO ACCOMPLISH IT.
SO, UM, A TYPE B ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION WOULD GIVE THE, ANY CITY, INCLUDING THE CITY OF PORT ARTHUR, GREATER FLEXIBILITY IN HOW TO USE ITS SALES TAX DOLLARS.
AND SO I ALWAYS RECOMMEND A TYPE B IF WE CAN'T DO AN M D D.
AND THE LAST FOLLOW OF MY QUESTION, UH, DO YOU THINK THAT IT WOULD BE MORE, I GUESS, CONTROVERSIAL TO HAVE BOTH WORLDS, UH, TYPE A AND TECH TYPE B A COMBINATION OF BOTH? HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THAT? UH, THAT'S A, YOU KNOW, THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION.
I REPRESENT, UM, I REPRESENT THE CITY OF RE UM, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATIONS.
THEY'VE GOT BOTH A TYPE A AND A TYPE B.
UM, AND IT'S INTERESTING HOW THAT, HOW THAT PLAYS OUT.
UM, I THINK IT COMES IN A, IN THE, THE BEST SITUATION WOULD BE A FULL CONVERSION FROM A TYPE A TO A TYPE B, THAT THAT'S MY POSITION.
BUT IF THAT'S NOT FEASIBLE FOR WHATEVER REASON, POLITICALLY OR SOME OTHER ISSUE, THEN THE CREATION OF A, OF A TYPE A TO THE EXTENT THAT, OR IF YOU HAVE A TYPE A, THEN THE CREATION OF A TYPE B, IF YOU HAVE EXTRA SALES DOLLARS TO CAPTURE WOULD BE THE NEXT BEST THING.
BUT, UM, I DON'T THINK HAVING TWO IS BENEFICIAL.
AND THE MAIN REASON IS BECAUSE IF YOU'RE A TYPE B CORPORATION, YOU HAVE THE SAME SPENDING AUTHORITY AS A TYPE A.
SO YOU MIGHT AS WELL CONVERT TO A TYPE B BECAUSE THEN YOU CAN SPEND THIS, YOUR MONEY ON TYPE A PROJECTS OR TYPE B PROJECTS.
IT GIVES YOU THE FULL FLEXIBILITY.
WELL, WHY IS THAT? UM, THANK YOU.
UH, WHY IS WHAT? JUST, JUST A MINUTE, JUST A MINUTE.
THANK YOU, CHARLIE, FOR YOUR ANSWER.
I WANT TO PIGGYBACK OFF WHAT COUNCILMAN, UH, KEN LAW WAS ASKING.
SO WHY DO INDIVIDUALS, UH, REMAIN A AND B IF YOU HAVE THE FULL SCOPE OF, UM, UH, AN A BY BECOMING A COMPLETE B? YEAH.
SO WHY DO INDIVIDUAL, WHY DO CITIES REMAIN A AND B? SO I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION BECAUSE IT'S GONNA BE DEPENDENT ON EACH, EACH INDIVIDUAL COMMUNITY AND THE THOUGHT PROCESSES AND IN, IN, IN THAT COMMUNITY AS TO WHY THEY DID SOMETHING.
BUT AT THE TOP OF MY HEAD, I THINK THERE'S PROBABLY ONLY THREE OR FOUR CITIES IN THE STATE OF TEXAS THAT ACTUALLY HAVE BOTH A TYPE A AND A TYPE B.
SO IT'S A VERY, VERY, VERY SMALL NUMBER.
I HAVE SOME MORE QUESTIONS, MARY, IF I MIGHT GO AHEAD.
UM, ONE OF THE CONCERNS THAT MANY INDIVIDUALS IN OUR COMMUNITY HAVE HAD OVER THE YEARS, UH, WHEN WE HAVE DISCUSSED IT, I HAD A CONVERSATION WHEN I FIRST BECAME A COUNCILMAN, UH, WITH THE, WITH THE, UH, DIRECTOR, UM, AT THE TIME THE C E O, UH, OF THE ECONOMIC COUNCIL.
AND HE WAS SAYING TO ME, UH, THAT HE DID NOT BELIEVE THAT WE NEEDED TO BECOME A B, UH, BECAUSE, UM, INDIVIDUALS, UM, WERE UNDER GREATER SCRUTINY, UH, OF BEING AB UH, AND THEN, UH, THE OTHER REASON THAT HE SHARED THAT WE SHOULD NOT BECOME A B WAS BECAUSE I THINK THAT THERE WAS SOME CONCERN FROM CITIZENS THAT THE, THE E D C COUNCIL WOULD BE OVERRUN BY CITY COUNCIL MEMBERS SITTING ON THE BOARD OF A B E D C.
CAN YOU KIND OF SHARE THE FORMULATION OF WHAT A B UH, DIRECTORSHIP WOULD LOOK LIKE? SURE.
I THINK I'M TRYING TO, HOW TO BEST ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.
'CAUSE I, I FEEL LIKE THE, THE DIRECT QUESTION, UM, ISN'T BROAD ENOUGH TO SORT OF RESPOND TO SOME OF THE ISSUES THAT YOU RAISED IN, IN, IN YOUR STATEMENT TO ME.
LET ME AD ADDRESS THE PREVIOUS DIRECTOR'S CONCERN THAT A TYPE B CORPORATION WOULD BE OVERRUN BY CITY COUNCIL, UM, BECAUSE OF THE DIRECTORSHIP, IT IS TRUE THAT UP TO FOUR MEMBERS OF A TYPE B CORPORATION CAN BE MEMBERS OF CITY COUNCIL.
AND IF THAT IS THE REASON WHY THEY THINK CITY COUNCIL WOULD OVERRUN THE BOARD BECAUSE OF DIRECTORSHIP, I WOULD SAY TO THAT, I WOULD SAY THIS CITY COUNCIL ALREADY HAS ALL THE AUTHORITY TO DICTATE HOW THE DOLLARS ARE SPENT, WHO'S APPOINTED, WHETHER THEY'RE REMOVED.
AND, UM, HAVING MEMBERS, IN MY EXPERIENCE, HAVING MEMBERS, ONE OR TWO MEMBERS OF CITY COUNCIL SITTING ON AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION FURTHERS
[00:50:02]
THE GOAL OF WORKING TOGETHER BETWEEN THE CITY COUNCIL AND THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT BOARD.AND SO I DON'T KNOW THAT I AGREE WITH YOUR, AND IT'S A VERY, YOU KNOW, POLITICAL, I SUPPOSE SUBJECTIVE OPINION WITH RESPECT TO THOSE, TO THOSE ISSUES.
UM, BUT I CAN'T THINK, OTHER THAN FOR POLITICAL REASONS, UM, I CAN'T THINK OF A REASON WHY YOU WOULDN'T WANT TO TRY TO BE A TYPE B TO GIVE YOURSELF THE GREATER TOOLS IN YOUR TOOLBOX, UH, WITH USE OF THOSE SALES TAX DOLLARS.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION FULLY OR NOT.
LASTLY, ONE MORE, MY LAST QUESTION, UH, IS THIS, I I DON'T BELIEVE IN HEEHAW AND I BELIEVE IN, UH, ADDRESSING THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM.
ONE OF THE PROBLEMS AND SITUATIONS THAT WE HAVE FACED, UH, HERE IS THAT THE GOVERNING BOARD, WHICH IS THE CITY COUNCIL, UM, DID NOT ACCEPT, UH, THE RECOMMENDATION OF ONE OF OUR CITY COUNCILMAN, UH, COUNCILMAN'S APPOINTMENT.
UH, AFTER HAVING DONE THAT, UM, THAT INDIVIDUAL WENT AND WAS SWORN IN BY A JUDGE.
IS THAT APPOINTMENT NULL AND VOID OR IS THAT, IS THAT WHERE, WHERE ARE WE WITH THAT? SO I'M GONNA GIVE YOU MY OPINION, JUST YOUR OPINION.
I'M JUST ONE LAWYER,
IF YOU DON'T COMPLY WITH THE LAW, THE ACTIONS YOU TAKE ARE VOID.
THE LAW REQUIRES AN APPOINTMENT TO BE BY THE GOVERNING BODY, NOT TO BE BY INDIVIDUAL COUNCIL MEMBERS.
IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE REASON WHY IT IS DONE BEING DONE THIS WAY IS BECAUSE THE BYLAWS OF THE ECONOMIC DEPARTMENT CORPORATION PROVIDE THAT IT CAN BE COMPLETED THAT WAY.
IS THAT AN ACCURATE STATEMENT? THE, THE BYLAWS OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION ARE NOT BINDING ON THE CITY COUNCIL.
THEY ARE THE BYLAWS OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.
WHEN I DRAFT AND CREATE BYLAWS, I NEVER PUT IN THE BYLAWS APPOINTMENTS OF THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
WHY? BECAUSE STATE LAW SAYS THE APPOINTMENT OF THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS IS AT THE PURVIEW OF THE GOVERNING BODY.
AND THE BYLAWS DON'T, DON'T APPLY TO CITY COUNCIL.
THEY ONLY APPLY TO THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION.
MANY NONPROFIT CORPORATIONS WILL HAVE INFORMATION IN THEIR BYLAWS REGARDING APPOINTMENTS, BUT THAT'S USUALLY BECAUSE THAT BOARD APPOINTS ITS OWN MEMBERS.
THAT GOVERNING BODY OF THE CITY COUNCIL APPOINTS THOSE MEMBERS.
AND SO, UM, A SINGLE APPOINTMENT BY A SINGLE COUNCIL MEMBER IS NOT CONSISTENT WITH THE LAW AND IS NOT VALID IN MY OPINION.
I WILL ADDRESS YOUR SECOND QUESTION.
THAT PERSON WENT AND GOT SWORN IN, UM, BY A JUDGE.
UM, IT DOESN'T MATTER TO ME THAT I DON'T WHERE IS IT A REQUIREMENT THAT, THAT YOUR BOARD MEMBER, THAT YOUR E D C DIRECTORS GET SWORN IN? 'CAUSE TO ME THAT'S NOT RELEVANT TO THE, TO THE FACT PATTERN BECAUSE UNDER THE LAW, ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DIRECTORS ARE NOT OFFICERS OF THE STATE.
SO THEY, THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED TO BE SWORN IN.
THEY'RE DIRECTORS ON A BOARD OF DIRECTORS.
AS A MATTER OF FACT, THE STATUTE VERY SPECIFICALLY SAYS THAT AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CORPORATION IS NOT A POLITICAL SUBDIVISION OF THE STATE.
AND IT'S ACTUALLY ONE OF THE RE IF YOU WANT TO KNOW, YOU KNOW, MORE EVIDENCE OF WHY IT'S NOT AN OFFICER.
CONFLICT OF INTEREST LAWS FOR OFFICERS UNDER STATE LAW DON'T APPLY TO ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DIRECTORS.
WE HAVE AN AG OPINION THAT SAYS THAT.
UH, COUNCILMAN LEWIS, HOW YOU DOING? APPRECIATE YOUR, YOUR PRESENTATION.
I WAS ON THE INCEPTION OF THE, THE SETTING UP THE CORPORATION, MINIMUM FIVE.
WE SET IT UP APPOINTMENT BY APPOINTMENTS.
DISTRICT ONE, DISTRICT FOUR, DISTRICT FIVE, APPOINTED TWO MEMBERS.
DISTRICTS TWO, DISTRICT SIX, DISTRICT THREE APPOINTED TWO MEMBERS, SEVEN AND EIGHT.
AND THE MAYOR APPOINTED THE FIFTH ONE LATER ON DIDN'T REQUIRE, THOSE WERE APPOINTMENTS, NOBODY VOTED ON
[00:55:01]
IT.LATER ON, WE EXPANDED THE NINE.
SO WE DECIDED GIVE EVERY COUNCIL MEMBER IT WAS NINE MEMBER COUNT.
EACH COUNCIL MEMBER AN APPOINTEE.
THE GOVERNING BODY DICTATES HOW THE, HOW THE BOARD IS CONSTITUTED WHAT WE DID SOMETHING GREATER.
WE PUT IN THE BYLAWS, EACH COUNCIL MEMBER CAN APPOINT SOMEONE WITHOUT ANY INTERFERENCE.
AND THAT'S WHAT WE, THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE.
NOW THE WAY I LOOK AT IT, IF THE, YOU WANNA GO BACK TO THE GOVERNING BODY TO DO THE APPOINTMENTS OR, OR HOWEVER THEY WANT TO NOMINATE IT, AND THE MAJORITY VOTER WHAT TO DO THAT YOU HAVE TO AMEND OR DISABLE THE BYLAWS BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THEY DECIDE TO DO.
SO, SO ONCE THEY GAVE THAT RIGHT UP FROM THE PRIMARY AND THEY WENT TO THE SECONDARY AND PUT ALL THE AUTHORITY UNDER THE SECONDARY, YOU GOTTA, YOU GOTTA DISABLE THAT OR REMOVE THAT, THEN YOU GO BACK TO THE PRIMARY.
UH, IT'S EASY TO, IT IT IS GOTTA BE REAL.
WHEN PEOPLE GIVING THEIR OPINION, YOU GOT AN OPINION, I GOT AN OPINION.
YOU SOMETIME YOU SLAN IT, IT THROWS A, A LOT OF THE PEOPLE'S THOUGHT PROCESS THROWS IT ALL, AND THEY THINKS THAT'S BEHIND THEM.
THEY ADOPTED WHAT THE COUNCIL DID.
AND WHEN THE SEE THE, THE COUNCIL CANNOT DICTATE TO THE E D C, THE COUNCIL SET RULES UP, SEND IT TO THE E D C.
IF THE EED C IN INITIATE SOMETHING, THEN THEY HAVE TO, THEY, THEY'LL, THEY'LL APPROVE IT.
THEY HAVE TO SEND IT UP TO COUNCIL FOR FINAL APPROVAL.
THESE THINGS WORKS FINE UNTIL SPECIAL INSURANCE GET INVOLVED.
AND BECAUSE THEY DON'T CARE FOR SOMEONE.
AND THEY WANT, AND THEY THINK, AND, AND, AND THE INTERESTING THING WE SET, WE SET IT UP UNDER THE BYLAWS.
SO, BUT I, I TALKED TO THE CITY ATTORNEY.
WE NEED IN HER THE FORM THAT SHE PRESENTED TO THE COUNCIL, THE APPOINTMENT, THAT FORM IS WRONG.
AND THAT VOTE CONFLICT WITH APPOINTMENT, THAT VOTE TO ME IS PSEUDO.
THAT'S A PSEUDO, A PSEUDO AUTHORITY IS FALSE.
NOW THE OATH THAT THE JUDGE GAVE THE A SWORN, THE MY APPOINTEE, THAT IS A STATE OATH.
THAT'S THE OATH THAT'S GIVEN TO ALL ELECTED OFFICIALS AND APPOINTED OFFICIALS IF THEY CHOOSE TO USE THAT.
THAT'S THAT SAME JUDGE APPOINTS SWEAR SWO IN PA PUT OUT THE INDEPENDENT SCHOOL DISTRICT TRUSTEES.
THAT SAME JUDGE OF GIVE THE OATH TO THE POLICE OFFICER.
THAT SAME JUDGE GIVE THE OATH TO DISTRICT JUDGES.
IF A PASTOR A, A MARRIAGE LICENSE, IF A STATE LICENSE, IF A PASTOR REFUSED TO MARRY A COUPLE, IF THEIR PASTOR REFUSES TO MARRY, THEY CAN GO TO THE JUSTICE OF PEOPLE WITH THE SAME, THE SAME LAW, THE SAME, UH, THING.
IT DOESN'T NOT, IT'S THE, IT'S WHAT THE STATE LAW ALLOWED.
IT'S NOT THE PERSON THAT'S GIVING IT.
IT'S NOT SOMEBODY IN THE CITY SECRETARY'S OFFICE.
S SWEARING A PERSON IN MAKES IT ILLEGAL.
THAT OATH IS A STATE OATH GIVEN TO ALL STATE OFFICIALS, ELECTED OFFICIALS, AND ALL APPOINTED.
YOUR QUESTION FOR HIM, UH, MR. LEWIS? MY QUESTION IS MY OPINION.
OKAY, CHARLIE, YOU, ME, YOU, YOU MENTIONED A COUPLE THINGS THAT I REALLY WANTED TO HIT ON BECAUSE I THINK THOSE ARE THINGS THAT WE REALLY COULD GET TOGETHER ON ONE, WE'VE DECIDED, AND YOU EXPLAINED IT, THAT THE E D C IS SEPARATE.
AND I THINK WHEN YOU TALK A AND B, B IS NOT A NONPROFIT, IS IT? IT IS.
SO WE JUST NEED TO UNDERSTAND THAT WHERE ALL THEM THREE CIRCLES CAME TOGETHER, YOU KNOW, THAT MIDDLE YOU WAS TALKING ABOUT? YES SIR.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT WE REALLY NEED TO DO AS A BOARD AND AS A COUNCIL.
AND YOU SAY, LIKE YOU SAY, WHEN WE MEET, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S SOMETHING WE WOULD LIKE OF THE E D C IN DEVELOPMENT, YOU KNOW, WE TALK TO THEM, BUT UNDERSTAND THEIR ROLE
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AND IT'S THEM TO OPERATE.BECAUSE THERE'S ANOTHER THING THAT'S THE KEY HERE THAT YOU SAID, AND I THINK WE AS COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD UNDERSTAND, THE E D C IS GOVERNED BY 5 0 4.
THEY ANSWER, THEY ARE ACCOUNTABLE TO THIS COUNCIL.
THEY CAN'T DO CONTRACTS, THEY CAN'T DO AGREEMENTS UNLESS THIS COUNCIL APPROVE IT.
HOWEVER, THEY ARE GOVERNED BY 5 0 4.
HOW THEY SPEND THAT MONEY AND THE PROJECTS THEY UNDERTAKE IS NOT WHAT WE WOULD LIKE.
IT'S WHAT 5 0 4 SAYS, YOU MUST COMPLY.
SO THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE TYPE THINGS THAT THEY DO AND THEN ALIGN THAT WITH THEM.
AND I THINK ONCE WE STARTED DOING THAT, WE COULD GET RID OF SOME OF THIS, UH, DIVISION OR DIFFERENT IDEAS.
I THINK IT'S, IT'S COMMUNICATIONS AND UNDERSTANDING AND I THINK THIS TRAINING BROUGHT A LOT OF THAT OUT TODAY.
UH, AND IF WE JUST KEEP ALL THIS IN MIND AND WORK TOGETHER TO GET IN THE MIDDLE OF THAT, I THINK WE'RE GONNA IRON ALL THIS OUT.
BECAUSE I THINK A LOT CAME OUT, OUT OF IT.
YOU KNOW, I KNOW I GOT A LOT OUT OF IT, THANK YOU AND EVERYTHING.
BUT I DO BELIEVE THAT WE JUST GOTTA GET IN THE MIDDLE.
AND THE WAY YOU GET THERE IS BY DISCUSSING THINGS LIKE WE'RE DOING TODAY.
AND EVERYBODY GET TO SAY WHAT THEY GOTTA SAY, PUT IT ALL ON THE TABLE.
'CAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY WAY YOU COULD WORK WITH IT, YOU KNOW? RIGHT.
PLEASE STAY CHARLIE, BUT YOU STILL OWE ME A COCO.
THANK, THANK YOU MR. OH, UH, OUR E D C BOARD MEMBERS.
UH, I, I DON'T HAVE A WAY OF KNOWING IF YOU WANT TO SPEAK, BUT DO YOU, UH, ANYONE, IF YOU RAISE YOUR HAND AND I CAN RECOGNIZE YOU, YOU GOOD? OKAY.
EVERYONE ELSE? YOU OKAY? OKAY.
NO, WE NOT NOW WE WANT ANYTHING FROM, WE DON'T WANT ANYTHING FROM THE GALLERY AT THIS POINT.
IF YOU WOULD LISTEN TO ME, PLEASE.
I'M NOT RECOGNIZING THE GALLERY RIGHT NOW.
SO YOU, YOU ALL ARE NOT, UH, YOU, YOU ALL ARE GOOD.
AND NO QUESTIONS FOR THE ATTORNEY.
COUNCILMAN LEWIS, YOU'RE LIKE, IS BACK ON.
WE HAVE AN, A CORPORATION DEALING WITH MANUFACTURING JOB.
AS AS PROJECTS NEEDED UNDER FOUR B AS THEY TO DEVELOP 'EM.
AND WE PUT IT ON A BALLOT AND ASK THE, THE TAX BILL DO TO VOTE ON IT.
CITY MANAGERS NEED PARKS MONEY FOR PARKS FOUR B PROJECT BALLOT.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE BALLOT FOR THREE YEARS WITH, WITH TWO THIRD VOTES OF THE COUNCIL OR, OR A MAJORITY OF VOTER.
THE COUNCIL CAN EXTEND IT FOR ANOTHER THREE YEARS.
YOU, YOU DO THE, THE B PROJECTS AS NEEDED.
YOU DON'T NEED TO HAVE A VOTE.
IF YOU NEED A BE PROJECT TO DO SOME STREETS, PARKS, WHATEVER, PUT IT ON THE BALLOT AND LET THE CITIZEN SAY YES OR NO.
AND THAT'S HOW WE'VE BEEN DOING IT.
POINT OF POINT, POINT OF HONOR.
MR. LEWIS, YOUR OPINION, WE APPRECIATE IT, BUT WHOA, WHOA, WHOA, WHOA, WHOA.
HE CALLED THE POINT OF ORDER POINT.
WE GOTTA VOTE ON THAT POINT OF ORDER.
YOU DON'T, YOU CAN'T CALL THAT WE VOTE ON THAT POINT OF VOTER.
UH, WE HAVE A POINT OF ORDER ON MR. LEWIS SO HE CAN DISCONTINUE THAT, UH, NEED A MOTION ON IT.
THE POINT OF ORDER IS THAT HE'S GIVEN HIS OPINION AGAIN AND WE ARE PROLONGING THIS MAN'S TIME AND WE, WE WANNA MOVE ON.
THANK YOU FOR BEING SO KIND, SIR.
NOW, UH, ANYTHING ELSE FOR THE ATTORNEY FROM EITHER ONE OF THESE BOARDS FROM CITY OR THE, UH, E D C BOARD? I THINK I JUST ASKED THAT AND THAT, THAT THEY'RE NOT END UP WELL.
UH, AS THE MAYOR OF THE CITY OF PORT ARTHUR, WE APPRECIATE YOUR TAKING THE TIME TO COME TO DELIVER TO US INFORMATION THAT IS PERTINENT TO OUR EXISTENCE.
AS COUNCILMAN DE SAID, AS YOU KNOW, YOU HAD THE GRAPH THERE, BUT EACH OF THEM, I BELIEVE THEY CALLED IT THE GEOMETRY.
AND I, I KIND OF PAID A LITTLE ATTENTION IN CLASS
AND, AND, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, AS, AS EACH, EACH OF THOSE, UH, UH, SEPARATE CIRCLES, AT SOME POINT THEY COME TOGETHER.
OKAY? THAT'S WHERE THE HARMONY, IF YOU WILL, 'CAUSE I'LL USE A MUSICAL TERM.
YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE THE HARMONY COMES IN,
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IN PARTICULAR IN THAT PARTICULAR POINT, YOUR OPINION.SO THE HARMONY THAT WE ARE SEARCHING FOR OKAY.
IS OUR BEING A COLLABORATIVE BODY FOR THE CITIZENS OF PORT ARTHUR, TEXAS.
AND YOU HAVE COME, YOU'VE DELIVERED TO US INFORMATION, I BELIEVE THAT WILL HELP US GOING FORWARD, UNDERSTANDING WHAT EACH ROLE IS FOR EACH GROUP.
AND NOT THAT SOMEONE IS JUST OVER SOMEONE.
AND CONTRARY TO WHAT HAS BEEN SAID, I DON'T THINK THAT ANYTHING WAS DONE OR HAS BEEN DONE AGAINST A PERSONALITY.
OKAY? AND I DON'T WANT THE RECORD TO REFLECT THAT.
CONTRARY TO STATEMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE IN THIS MEETING OR INSINUATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN MADE.
NO ONE I KNOW FOR SURE I HAVE NOT DONE ANYTHING MALICIOUSLY AGAINST AN INDIVIDUAL BECAUSE OF WHO OR WHO HE OR SHE MAY BE.
MY DECISIONS WAS BASED, HAS BEEN BASED AND WILL BE BASED UPON WHAT I BELIEVE IS GOOD FOR THE CITIZENS IN THE CITY OF PORT ARTHUR.
LIKE THIS MEETING TODAY IS GOOD FOR THE CITIZENS.
THANK YOU, SIR, FOR COMING OUT.
NOW IF SOMEONE IN THE GALLERY OKAY.
WHICH IS TO MAKE SOME STATEMENTS BEFORE WE CLOSE.
IS NOT ANYTHING POSTED FOR STATEMENTS, BUT A CITIZEN MAY ASK A TRAINING QUESTION TO THE TRAINER.
BUT IF THERE'S ANY QUESTIONS OKAY.
THAT CITIZENS HAVE ABOUT THE TRAINING, BUT IT'S NOT AN OPEN DISCUSSION.
BUT YOU'RE CERTAINLY WELCOME TO HAVE A TRAINING QUESTION.
BUT THIS IS, YEAH, THIS IS TRAINING.
SO LIKE THE COUNCIL ASKS QUESTIONS.
IF THEY HAVE QUESTIONS OF THE TRAINER, THEN WE CAN OPEN IT UP.
DO YOU HAVE, DO, IS YOUR QUESTION FOR THE TRAINER? NO, SIR.
I WANT YOU TO SPEAK WHEN YOU COME UP, INTRODUCE YOURSELF.
NO, WE ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM.
NO, NO, BUT JUST COME UP, COME UP TO THE MIC.
LET'S ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM THEN, SINCE Y'ALL BROUGHT IT UP.
JUST FIRST OF ALL, INTRODUCE YOURSELF.
I LIVE, SIR, 2 3 6 6 60 SECOND STREET.
I HAVE THE SECOND ADDRESS IS 6 1 5 0 GONER READY TO ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM.
YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE TRAINER? A QUESTION? TALK ABOUT MICROMANAGEMENT.
WE KNOW THAT MICROMANAGEMENT HAS BEEN GOING ON BECAUSE OUR DIRECTOR, TERRY STOKES, HAS BEEN HAVING PRIVATE MEETINGS WITH INDIVIDUALS ON THIS COUNCIL, HAS ALSO TRIED TO SET UP PRIVATE MEETINGS WITH INDIVIDUALS.
I'M GOING TO STOP THE POINT OF ORDER, SIR.
POINT OF, I'M RUNNING THIS MEETING AND I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO STOP.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO CALL AN INDIVIDUAL'S NAME.
YOU ARE NOT GOING TO DEGRADE ANYBODY UP HERE, SIR? SIR, SIR, YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR THE TRAINER? NOW, IF YOU DON'T HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT A TRAINER, I'M GONNA ASK YOU TO SIT DOWN, BE CONSIDERED MICROMANAGEMENT, HAVING MEETINGS.
IT WOULDN'T BE A PUBLIC MEETING.
IT WOULDN'T BE A CALL MEETING.
WOULDN'T THAT BE MICROMANAGEMENT? I FIRST, I, GO AHEAD, SIR.
I APPRECIATE, I WOULD APPRECIATE YOU NOT YELLING AT ME.
I DON'T THINK I, I'M UPSET BECAUSE THEY WANT TO ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT ROOM, BUT NOBODY IN THIS ROOM WANTS TO TALK, HONEST.
BUT THEY SIT UP THERE SAYING WHAT THEY WANT.
SIR, SIR, SIR, SIR, IF YOU HAVE A QUESTION FOR HIM, WILL NOT ADDRESS, SAY, STATE YOUR QUESTIONS, SIR.
OR EXCUSE YOURSELF FROM THIS ROOM.
CHIEF, WILL YOU EXCUSE MARCH HIM OUTTA THE ROOM, PLEASE.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO ANSWER ANYTHING.
I, I'M ACTUALLY, YOU DON'T HAVE TO SAY ANYTHING.
I'M ACTUALLY JUST DON'T FEEL OBLIGATED.
UH, ACTUALLY IT'S NOT MICROMANAGEMENT.
AND I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ACTIONS OF MY CITIZENS.
OKAY? I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ACTIONS OF MY CITIZENS.
I'VE BEEN DOING THIS A LONG TIME.
I UNDERSTAND, BUT JUST TO, BECAUSE IT'S NOT, I JUST WANNA STATE, 'CAUSE IT'S NOT MICROMANAGEMENT, IT'S ACTUALLY PART OF THE PRESENTATION WHERE I SAID WE NEED TO HAVE COMMUNICATION AT THE STAFF LEVEL AND AT THE BOARD LEVEL.
SO THAT'S ACTUALLY HAVING THE EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR COMMUNICATE WITH STAFF, COMMUNICATE WITH COUNCIL MEMBERS.
THAT'S PART OF THE PROCESS AND IS NOT MICROMANAGEMENT.
WHEN I TALK ABOUT MICROMANAGEMENT, I'M TALKING ABOUT ONCE WE CREATED, ONCE WE CREATE THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES AND THE TOGETHERNESS TO MOVE THE COMMUNITY FORWARD, THAT THE COUNCIL THEN ALLOW THE BOARD SOME
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LATITUDE TO CONDUCT THOSE ACTIVITIES RATHER THAN MICROMANAGE THOSE ACTIVITIES.AND, AND, AND ACCORDING TO MICROMANAGEMENT AND THE INSINUATION OF THAT, I DON'T THINK THAT ANYBODY UP HERE HAS EVER AT, I KNOW I'VE BEEN HERE FOUR YEARS AND NO ONE HAS TRIED TO MICROMANAGE E D C IN ANY SHAPE, FORM, OR FASHION.
OKAY? AND I COULD, I CAN SAY THAT I, I, AND, AND BE VERY, VERY ADAMANT ABOUT MY SAYING IT ON THIS COUNCIL.
AND THERE HAS BEEN NO INFERENCE THAT I KNOW OF, OF SOMEONE JUST TRYING TO DO SOMETHING AGAIN, TO HURT ANY INDIVIDUALS.
BUT EVERYONE HAS HIS OR OPINION.
AND AGAIN, I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ACTION OF A CITIZEN.
UH, I HOPE IT WASN'T THREATENING TO YOU.
CERTAINLY WASN'T TO ME, BUT HE WAS IN CLOSE PROXIMITY TO YOU.
OKAY? SO I APOLOGIZE FOR THAT, SIR.
IF THERE WOULD BE NO OTHER, OH, EXCUSE ME.
GO RIGHT AHEAD, CHARLIE, IN YOUR TWO MINUTE, UH, ENDING SPEECH, YOU GOT, WE HAVE THE CIRCLES UP THERE WHERE WE TALKED ABOUT THE ALIGNMENT AND YOU KIND OF BRIEFLY, YOU KNOW, TALKED ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE THREE ENTITIES, THE LAW, THE E D C, AND OF COURSE THE GOVERNING BODY.
GIMME YOUR TWO MINUTE SPILL ON, UH, HOW DO WE CONTINUE RELATIONSHIP AND, AND BUILD THAT ALIGNMENT, UH, COMMUNICATION.
I MEAN, I, THAT I CAN SUM THAT TWO MINUTE SPEECH UP IN, IN, IN THAT, IN THAT STATEMENT COMMUNICATION.
AND IT MEANS, UM, MEETING ON A REGULAR BASIS TO DISCUSS THE, WHAT THE APPROPRIATE USE OF THOSE TAX DOLLARS ARE FOR THE GOALS AND OBJECTIVES OF THE COMMUNITY, AND ENSURE EVERYBODY'S IN ALIGNMENT IN THAT AND MOVING FORWARD ON THAT.
AND THAT TAKES, I'LL ADD ONE MORE.
IT TAKES COMMUNICATION AND IT TAKES TRUST.
LET'S TRUST THAT THEY'RE GONNA MOVE FORWARD IN THE WAY THAT YOU HAVE DIRECTED AND GUIDED THEM TO DO.
AND OF COURSE, IF THEY DON'T, NO OFFENSE TO THE BOARDS, YOU HAVE THE AUTHORITY AS A COUNCIL TO REMOVE THOSE INDIVIDUALS AND, AND, AND PUT PEOPLE IN PLACE WHO WILL DO THAT.
UH, COUNCILWOMAN BECKHAM, I, I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION FOR THE CITY ATTORNEY.
IS THERE AN ELECTRONIC COPY OF THE BYLAWS OF THE E D C? YES.
UM, I CAN SEND THE 2018 AND I THINK WE DID ONE IN 22, BUT I'LL SEND THAT, I'LL GO DO THAT IN A MINUTE.
AND CHARLIE'S PRESENT, UH, MR. ZACK.
ATTORNEY ZACK'S PRESENTATION TOO.
I'LL SEND IT TO YOU IN A FEW MINUTES.
I'LL SEND THAT AND THEN THE BYLAWS.
AND AN HOUR LONG VERSION OF THAT PRESENTATION.
GO TO P&L ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CONFERENCE,
BEFORE WE, BEFORE WE CLOSE, UH, I KNOW COUNCILMAN BECKHAM AND MAYBE, UH, BOTH, BOTH OF OUR, WELL, THE NEW COUNCIL PERSONS HERE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAD BEEN AFFORDED THIS OPPORTUNITY BEFORE I ATTENDED THE TRAINING.
I THINK WHEN I FIRST MET YOU, UH, IN SAN ANTONIO OR SOMETHING WHERE WE WERE WITH YEAH.
AND THAT, AND, AND, AND THE, UH, TRAINING IS ABOUT E D C, I THINK TEXAS A AND M, UH, IS THE CAMPUS THAT, THAT ACTUALLY HANDLES IT.
WE COULD SEEK OUT, UH, WHEN THAT TRAINING IS, YOU WOULD LEARN.
'CAUSE EVERYTHING THAT HE TALKED ABOUT IS WHAT I, I LEARNED AT THAT TRAINING WHENEVER THIS WAS A COUPLE YEARS AGO.
YOU WILL BE WELL-VERSED ON THE FUNCTIONING OF THE E D C, TYPE A, TYPE B, NO MATTER WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHICHEVER WHAT, WHAT, WHAT HE'S TALKING ABOUT.
AND WE, YOU WOULD UNDERSTAND ALL OF THE LIMITS IF THE, IF, IF YOU WILL, THAT OR APPLIED WITH THE COUNCIL AND THE INTERACTIONS THAT A COUNCIL AND, UH, THE BOARD OF DIRECTORS FOR B D C MAY HAVE IF THEY ARE, AGAIN, IN AN HARMONIOUS TYPE RELATIONSHIP WHERE YOU'RE GONNA WORK COLLABORATIVELY.
SO I'LL CHECK ON IT AND I CAN SHARE IT WITH YOU ALL.
BUT I MEAN, YOU KNOW, EACH TIME YOU GO, I'M SAYING, YEAH, EACH TIME YOU GO, YOU, YOU'RE GOING TO GET UPDATED AND THE INFORMATION AND, UH, YOU EVEN GET A CERTIFICATE, UH, FOR COMPLETING IT.
IT'S SOMETHING THAT THE E D C, UH, CEOS MUST ATTEND, YOU KNOW? BUT OTHER THAN THAT, UH, OTHERS, AND EVEN YOU, THE BOARD, IF YOU ALL HAVE NEVER GONE TO IT, IT IS A GREAT, I THINK IT'S ABOUT TWO DAYS OR THREE DAYS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THAT YOU WOULD BE THERE AND GREAT, GREAT INFORMATION ON IT.
[01:15:01]
ETT.I THINK ALSO MAYOR IN LINE WITH THAT, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THEM.
I THINK MAYBE WE SHOULD, UH, TAKE A LOOK AT, UH, ATTENDING AN E D C TYPE CONFERENCE WHERE WE, WE AUTHORIZE OURSELVES.
ADD THAT ONE TOO, BECAUSE THERE'S ONE IN HOUSTON.
BECAUSE OF THE PROBLEM THAT WE'VE INCURRED, I THINK WE NEED TO ALSO GO AND GET SOME TRAINING, TRAINING AND EXPOSURE ON THEIR EX ON, ON THEIR SIDE OF THE HOUSE, SO WE COULD BETTER UNDERSTAND THAT SIDE OF THE HOUSE.
JUST LIKE WE EXPECT THEM TO SEE OUR, SO MAYBE WE NEED TO TAKE A LOOK AT, I TOLD ATTEND E C.
BUT MR. STOKES, UH, THE EMAIL I RECEIVED THE OTHER DAY ON THE T DMM, I T M I'M SORRY.
I'M THINKING ABOUT DIVERSITY MATTER EDC.
YEAH, BUT ON, ON THE E D C MEETING, IT'S GOING TO BE IN HOUSTON, ISN'T IT? YES, SIR.
IT'S GONNA BE REAL CLOSE FOR TWO OR THREE DAYS.
IT'S IN OCTOBER ONCE WE RETURNED FROM T M L, BUT IT'S IN OCTOBER.
AND I, WHEN I LOOKED AT THE AGENDA FOR THAT, I THOUGHT ABOUT IT AS SOMETHING AGAIN, GOOD FOR ALL OF US TO BE THERE, IF POSSIBLE, TO GET EXPOSED TO INFORMATION CONCERNING THE E D C TO, TO DEAL WITH THE YES.
THEY SENT ME AN EMAIL A DAY OR TWO AGO.
COUNCILMAN LEWIS, JUST BRIEFLY.
CITY ATTORNEY, CITY SECRETARY, AND THE, AND THE CHAIRMAN OF THE PRESIDENT OF THE E D C BOARD.
OVER A MONTH AGO, I REQUESTED ALL CHANGES TO THE E D C BYLAWS AND I HAVE NOT RECEIVED THEM.
AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING IS CITY SECRETARY'S OFFICE HAS SUBMITTED IT THERE.
THE REASON I'M REQUESTING IT, BECAUSE THE E D C BYLAWS HAVE BEEN TAMPERED WITH.
UH, SEE, NO, YOUR LIFE IS JUST ON.
I THOUGHT YOU WERE GONNA RESPOND.
NOW, UH, IF THERE'LL BE NO OTHER BUSINESS TO COME BEFORE THIS GREAT ARGUS ABOUT IT, I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION FOR A JOURNAL ADJOURNMENT.
UH, COUNCILMAN DOUCETTE, MOVE FOR ADJOURNMENT.
MAY I APPROACH IT SECOND? ALWAYS.
DID YOU GET YOUR THING, YOUR BAG? OH YEAH.
UH, OPPOSED? I DON'T THINK WE HAVE ANY.